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Ref: MAT2_B02 |
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Part B –2 |
2. North American Society & Movement
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Excerpts & Historical Context: Parallel Lives in Perspective |
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Quotes from interviews of Wanda and Jack |
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Wanda’s Early Life: We actually
moved into |
Wanda with Colleagues in the We [Wanda & 3 co-workers: Wink, Jerry &
Glenn] are going down the mountain.
And Jerry stands up and she is screaming. And Wink and Glenn are still trying to
maneuver so they can get a hold of the wheel.
And Jerry is screaming. And I
smacked her in the face, and said: shut up! And I'm sitting there going
"steer into the side of the mountain!" And that's how we were stopped; they
steered into the side of the mountain. But, it was a horrible experience. –
Wanda D. Keefe |
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Jack in the The Russian subs were there[west
coast of |
Wanda as Foreigner entering USA JJK: [Wanda
went] to WDK: I
was disgusted with how they treated the others -- because there was a lot of
Russians coming into the country and a lot of other people coming
through. And they treated me very
nicely because I spoke English, I was Canadian. But some of those people who couldn't speak
English, that were coming across, they really treated them like cattle. And I was telling Mom about how disgusted I
was. And I said: "a terrible way
they treated the foreigners" and
his mother started to laugh, she said “what do you think you are?” I said you
know, you're right, I never thought of that. (Laughter) |
Interview Abbreviations: JJK
= Jack [John Joseph] Keefe; WDK
= Wanda Davis Keefe; AKK
= Adhiratha Kevin Keefe
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Table of Contents 2. North American Society
& Movement.......................................................................................... 1 Jack & Wanda's Parents and Relatives............................................................................................................. 3 Wanda’s Cabinet Maker Father & Great Aunt
Athabasca Trail Driver................................................................ 3 Wanda's Relatives served in the Civil War]........................................................................................................... 4 Movement
during Depression and Before War:............................................................................................... 4 Selling family furniture to survive during the
depression...................................................................................... 6 People moving, taking odd jobs “Honey Wagon”, Relief & Welfare.................................................................... 7 Wanda's Schooling and sports................................................................................................................................ 7 Adjustment From One room schoolhouse to city /school
-WDK......................................................................... 8 High School Career Planning l –WDK.................................................................................................................. 8 Polio, Jack Schooling and Sports Illustrated
presentation.......................................................................... 9 Principal wanted Keefe to go to a special school................................................................................................. 11 Jack and Wanda’s Yukon Work Experience................................................................................................... 12 6. Midnight
Recreation Picnics........................................................................................................................... 13 Train Travel and Jack & Wanda’s meeting.................................................................................................... 13 .10. Troop ship reaction to beans, coffee & lecture
on patriotism................................................................ 14 11. Riding on the narrow gage railroad.......................................................................................................... 15 7. Dapper Dan, Jack first day in Whitehorse – meets
Wanda............................................................................. 17 12 Jeep backwards down the mountain, Wanda takes charge..................................................................... 18 Radio...................................................................................................................................................................... 18 U 1920's Radio - Happiness Boys Programs................................................................................................. 19 V Chicklets & Barbeso................................................................................................................................... 19 Film......................................................................................................................................................................... 19 8. Going to Whitehorse, Food, Movies............................................................................................................... 20 Recognizing Films by the tune............................................................................................................................. 20 9. An Irishman’s story: The great contractor uses the elements.................................................................... 21 War Production Locations -mostly South and West...................................................................................... 21 Jack and Wanda describe their Yukon co-workers:.............................................................................................. 22 19. Soldiers in Yukon: American, Canadian, Russian.......................................................................................... 23 20. Working outside in the cold Yukon................................................................................................................ 24 Communities......................................................................................................................................................... 24 Not returning to Canada.................................................................................................................................... 25 Immigrants............................................................................................................................................................. 26 |
Jack & Wanda's Parents and Relatives
Jack and Wanda were
raised in
Some of the interview stories illustrate that Wanda’s
family had a history of mobility dating back to before the
Wanda’s Cabinet Maker Father & Great Aunt Athabasca Trail Driver[excerpt for full see jw00au14.rtf para 20] JJK: [Wanda's father] started in life as an
apprentice cabinetmaker. As a
matter-of-fact we have the cabinet which he made when he was about 14 years
of age. And it was all made with hand
tools. None of the electric tools or
anything like that. And of course he had
been a farmer for years near |
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JJK: One of your grandaunts,
[Wanda’s] Aunt Ella, as a youngster was very blond of
German extraction. Her father was a
drover and transported material from |
Wanda’s immediate family lived in western
Wanda's Relatives served in the Civil War][Except see jk00ap16.doc para 3 & 4 Common Families involved, Great, Great Grandfather/ AKK What
do you think and specifically about how the common families were involved?
[in the JJK. Well
we can look at that from the standpoint of your mother's[Wanda’s] family. Her
Great, Great Grandfather was
a man by the name of |
This next section provides excerpts of stories and secondary source comments which may give some of the flavor of the times .
Movement during Depression and Before War:
Wanda's parents and siblings were similar to others who had to
move around during the Depression in order to find work and keep
the family together. Jack and Wands were well aware of the devastation
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[excerpt:
see jw00se30.rtf para 15] AKK: There was a lot of movement
during the war too? People moving
across country. Jobs were better here
-- there. WDK: Oh Yeah. Well, that had even
started before the war. Because of the
Depression. Whole families were packing
up and leaving. JJK: Sure, the Okies
[Oklahoman, Texans and others trying to escape the devastation caused by dry
weather in the Dust Bowl and farm mechanization]. They picked up and went to WDK: The
rest of the country, I mean California was very uninhabited for long time
until the big storms, the dust storms and everything in JJK: They used to call it the
dirty 30s. The dirty 30s. Because of the dust storms. WDK: The world really changed
tremendously with the second world war.
And it was a terrible war but it also changed the whole economy. |
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[jw00se04.doc
para 3] AKK: You lived by yourself. And then Gwen [Wanda’s Sister] came and
joined you when you were working in WDK: Right.
When I finished up at the hospital, and went to work on the south side at the
Treasury Department. In the bank. My mother and father then went up to AKK: But,
it was pretty good pay for that time? WDK: Yeah,
for then it was. And Gwen and June went with them first and then
Gwen had to finish high school, so she came and lived with me |
The
Wanda Davis Keefe,
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Figure 5 = 4.d 1929 Fred,
Wanda, Gwen, Wildie & Stanley Davis The
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Figure 6 = 4e 1931 Dede,
June, Stanley, Wildie, Gwen, Wanda, Fred A
candid Shot of the |
Selling family furniture to survive during the depression[excerpt see jw00se04.doc para
4] AKK: When was the
time you told me it was really tough, where you would get some money together
and then you would buy back the beds you sold? WDK: 0h, that was when we lived in AKK: That
was during the Depression? WDK: Very
much so. After we first moved in
there. We actually moved into AKK: And
at least she wouldn't have to board then too.
And you would be together? WDK: Right,
right. And be with the family. And that's why we moved to AKK: And
that was pretty common to everyone at that time for what I hear everybody was
moving around and... WDK: Oh,
yeah! It was terrible. Jobs were scarce. That's when men were really selling apples
on street corners. I even remember
that. AKK: All
the way up there? I know in the big
cities down here they were, but up there too? WDK: Yeah, they were doing the same
thing there. And they were riding the
freight trains. Wasn't surprising at
all to see somebody at your back door asking for sandwich or a cup of soup or
something. And they moved from here to
there just trying to get by, trying to live. AKK: And
it wasn't considered sort of unrespectable at that time, it was just what did
you do. At least they were moving around
trying to get work? WDK: Right,
right, right. And they would come and
say "Can I chop wood for the day for a meal?" and all that. No, it
was tough, it was very tough times. People are more familiar with it in the |
People moving, taking odd jobs “Honey Wagon”, Relief & Welfare[excerpt see
jw00se04.doc para 5] AKK: Basically, people were moving around. They were doing anything. They put all their belongings from the farm
on the car or whatever and moved to the next town and tried to get something? WDK: We also lived on, what you call here Welfare. We call
it Relief there. But the men worked
for it. They would give them city jobs
going around picking up garbage and junk.
They would work so many days for that.
Then they would get tickets for clothes and money for the family. They would get, vouchers. So my father
worked at jobs like that. AKK: Since they did not have something like running sewage
from the outhouses, did they have to go around and clean them out? JJK: The honey wagons. WDK: That's right.
They had to go and pick that up.
That was a terrible job. AKK: Did they have honey wagons down here too? JJK: Not to my knowledge, no. They probably had been in
different parts of the states. They just didn't have them in AKK: But you knew about the honey wagons and you had heard
her stories. JJK: Well I heard her stories... WDK: We didn't call them honey wagons up there though. No, but they had lots of funny stories
about it. But the outhouses were built for it, with the trap door that came
up in the back. JJK: Sure, when I went with her and met members of her
family before we got married they had the back houses right there. Still there, this is in the city of |
The interviews provided a glimpse
of the different type of background and experiences Jack and Wanda had before
they met in
Wanda's Schooling and sports
Wanda was originally in a one room
school house. But at 11 years of age, she moved to the capital of the
Adjustment
From a One room schoolhouse to city
/school -WDK
[excerpt for full see jw00se04.doc para 02] AKK: We were talking about you going from a one room
schoolhouse to having 40 children in
class. What was that like for you? WDK: Scary, it was really overwhelming. When I look back. I didn't like it. I was very unhappy for quite awhile. I did not want to leave the farm in the
first place. You leave all the animals
,including your horse which you rode
all the time. All the great things about a farm you leave to go to the city.
And then of course there are all the city kids that are making fun of the
hicks from the farm. AKK: How old were you? WDK: Eleven. AKK: They all had bicycles when you had a horse? Some of them had bicycles? WDK: Not all of them. High School Career Planning l –WDK
WDK So, I finished up at the Eastwood school. I finished there and went to
start grade nine, which was high school at Eastwood. I went there for two years, grade nine and
10. And then talked my parents into
letting me go to a commercial high school.
To switch. Because I wanted to take commercial courses. |
Schlesinger reports that in
1935 in New England, basketball was regarded as primarily a pastime for girls
[B02-N01] Wanda has an interesting story about a
long-legged Canadian girl drawn to the sport but
withdrawing because of some unwanted attention.
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Basketball –WDK [excerpt for full see jw00se04.doc para 03] AKK: You knew you weren't going to go to the University so
you thought... WDK: I didn't want to be a teacher, I didn't
want to be a nurse. My father really
wanted me to be a nurse. I had no
desire to be a nurse at that time. And
I certainly didn't want to teach. I
wanted to get secretarial skills, which I did. I went to commercial high school and graduated from there. We had the Olympic girls basketball team
came from AKK: Was this the other girls who make fun, or the boys? WDK: No, the guys. They would be whistling and would be
calling us “snake hips” and all these remarks, and I just hated it. So I just quit playing basketball. AKK: Was your father encouraging you to play? WDK: Of course. He thought I was stupid when I quit. AKK: You enjoyed it. It was just that other part of it? WDK: I didn't like everyone looking at me and making fun of
me. AKK: Did they travel some too? WDK: 0h, yeah. They
went all over. They went all over the AKK: Then that was the last one. The didn't get canceled for the war then? JJK: They canceled out 1940. AKK: So, did you travel with them at all? WDK: No, no, I just played on school team there. But some also [later played on the Grads]. AKK: That was the
feeder teams? WDK: Right. Right.
The principal of the school was coach of the basketball
team AKK: So he was encouraging you. Were you considered tall? WDK: I was five foot six. Which was quite tall in those days I guess? But, I was all arms and legs and I didn't like the comments. |
Polio, Jack Schooling and Sports Illustrated presentation
Schlesinger notes that summers of his youth were
haunted by the specter of infantile paralysis, as polio was then known.
Children were forbidden from swimming pools and crowded places. [B02-N02] As Jack Keefe puts it, he was
one of the "lucky ones" who contacted polio during that time. The
following excerpt based on an interview
for a popular sports magazine in 1987 tells this story best. Jack’s parents
resisted placing him in special schools because of Jack’s polio produced
disability to his leg. They believed in keeping their son in the “mainstream”.
He walked with the aid of crutches or braces and was a very active youth.
Eventually Jack excelled in swimming related sports on his high school, college
and national ranked community teams.
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Jack Keefe Family |
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Figure 1 = 4.a 1918 Jack and Bessie Keefe with 3 Children: Tom, Frank, & Jack Jack would be teased later to say his father had the ventriloquist's dummy on his lap |
Figure 2 = 4.b 1927 Jack
Keefe, in Scout Uniform |
Excerpt of Jack's Story as reported
in SPOTLIGHT 23 March 1987, Sports Illustrated
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A MASTER OF A SWIMMER
: Undeterred by Polio, .Jack Keefe is a top backstroker
at 71 By RICHARD DEMAK Excerpt: [for complete text see jk87mr24.doc] |
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Jack Keefe always sits with his right leg
crossed over his left. That's the way he has sat for nearly 70 years. In
October 1916, 18 months after he was born, the poliomyelitis virus withered
his right leg It made the leg 4'/i inches shorter than the left one and no
bigger around than a the left one and no bigger around than a Little League bat barrel. Recalling the
illness that would change his life, Keefe says quietly, "There were
other children in our family, plus all the kids that I played with—the
Schlesinger kids and the Keefe was one of the best high
school swimmers on After not swimming competitively for almost
50 years, Keefe began entering masters events three years ago. Since then he
has rarely finished out of the first five in national championships, and for
the past two years, he has ranked in the top 10 in the 70-74 age division in
variety of backstroke events. At the 1985 His routine
there was the same as it is at every meet. He sat on the concrete deck
surrounding the pool, his back propped against the stands and his crutches
and brace laid at his side. When the time came for one of his events, he
hobbled to his lane, his right hand clutched around his right knee so that
the arm could thrust the leg forward. He slid into the water, turned around
and wrapped his hands around the railing of the starting block. He drew his
left knee toward his chest while the foot pressed against the pool wall. The
leg was poised to uncoil when he heard the gun. His right leg hung limply
beneath him. [photo Caption page 1 of article: At meets
Keefe supports the religious bent of one of his kids. Pictured wearing
"Sri Chinmoy Marathon Team" sweatshirt] |
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During a
race Keefe's backstroke looks like everybody else's, but the splash from his leg
kick is smaller. "I try to get some kick out of both legs," he
says. "I have a pretty powerful left leg, but the other leg dangles.
Someone joked that I might be better off if they had amputated that right leg
so that I could lessen the drag. I
guess he's right, but the hell with it." On July 4, 1983, some 11 months before;
Keefe had begun swimming in competition again, William Rynne
and his wife, Virginia, hosted their annual Independence Day cocktail party
at their home in Tuxedo Park, N.Y. Rynne won the
Distinguished Flying Cross in World War II, during which he shot down
five planes and later was shot down himself' and tortured as a prisoner of
war. Rynne knows something about heroism. But when Rynne introduced his friend Keefe to his guests, he told
them that his hero was Jack Keefe. Says Rynne,
"People have given me many medals and dinners, but what I had was just
physical courage. It doesn't compare to the spiritual courage of Jack. He's a
genuine hero." Although Keefe's leg kept the hero's hero
out of World War II, it didn't stop him from competing in sports. "He
was always first over the fence at the "My
father never pushed us, but he always had all the equipment ready,"
Keefe says. "He would play
catch with me by the hour. I told him I was going to be a big leaguer. He
never said anything but 'O.K.' " Before playing
basketball at Seton Hall, Jack's younger brother, George, was a starting guard on the The best
athlete in the family might have been Charlie, another brother. He died at
age 14 while exercising in the basement of their house. He was doing chin-ups when he caught himself on a wire and was
strangled. For weeks Jack's father would go to the basement and scream.
Twenty-nine years later George was killed in a car accident, and that, too,
traumatized Jack's father. "It was not exactly the kind of life that my
father had envisioned," says Jack. "Two sons were killed and
another had polio." |
Principal wanted Keefe to go to a special school When the Keefes moved to the [Page 2 Photo Caption: Keefe consistently
finishes in the top five in his age
division in national championships Pictured doing backstroke in the pool]. Keefe, however, knew that his leg would
prevent him from ever becoming a top-flight collegiate swimmer. So at |
Jack and Wanda’s Yukon Work Experience
Jack and Wanda met and worked
together in the
Train Travel and Jack & Wanda’s meeting
Train travel was an established form of transport for long
distance in
Jack had recently just returned to his home in
Troop ship
reaction to beans, coffee & lecture on patriotism
[excerpt, see jw00se30.rtf para 10] JJK: So on the way up to AKK: You mean their food, their
beans? JJK: And we feel, we really showed the army today. We showed the army. But the army showed
us.. When we got to |
On discussing their experience of traveling to
Riding on the narrow gage railroad
[excerpt, see jw00se30.rtf para 11] WDK: And the other day we talked
about riding on the narrow gauge (railroad).
And I said to him, oh I'm glad I didn't make the trip. I never wanted to. How could you stand it? He said, it was dark I couldn't see
anything.. (Chuckle) JJK: Couldn't see anything, I
slept through it (Laughter) AKK: Because it was known to be
really steep? WDK Not only that, it was about this wide across (arms
width). With the wheels, on the train,
and you would just look straight down. AKK: You mean it was like a single
track, and didn't have seats on either side? JJK: No, and it's the big, you
know, valleys, deep, deep. WDK: No, no, it had sides on the
train and everything, but I'm saying, the windows were down that low, and
there was nothing on each side. But
the track was there and it dropped. But it was on both sides. AKK: Were the trains, narrow trains
too? WDK: Yeah, and the train could only
go one-way. There was only one set of
tracks. So it got there and then it
would turn around and go back. With other people -- traffic, so you couldn't
meet anybody. If you met them
(trouble) --. All these years I didn't
know, you know, why he wasn't that much upset about it. He said, I couldn't see, it was dark.
(Chuckle) AKK: Because everybody else, who had
done the trip, when they told you about it, it was --. Had you done that trip too? WDK: No, no. I had no desire to do it. JJK: You could see it, you know,
when we went along the road. You could
see it. Later on we saw it. WDK: Yeah, oh I
could see it, and everything. It
pulled into |
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Jack and Wanda meet :
The first meeting of Wanda and Jack
also illustrates some of the procedures undertaken: files reviewed, weather specific clothing
issued, the organization of the shared office space and
how the staff all ate together in a mess hall.
Dapper
Dan, Jack first day in
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WDK: And he must have been
impressed. Because we went over --
Kathy Wetteland then was working in the personnel
and he checked in with her, I guess they assigned you and then you went and
got your clothes. JJK: I had to get all our winter
gear and get rid of my Hamburg. WDK: And your blankets for your bed
and all that. We used to go for lunch in a big Quonset hut that was a mess
Hall. And we would wait outside until
they opened the doors. I was talking
to Kathy and a group of other people and he was with two or three other guys
over at the side. And the next thing I
know I hear him going "Oh Kathy, Kathy" you know like Heathcliff?
(Chuckle) and all the time he's doing that, he's looking straight at
me. So he comes over and then Kathy has to introduce us. JJK: We
were formerly introduced. She used to call me Mr. Keefe. AKK: Kathy
did too? Or just Mom [Wanda]? WDK: No,
but he wasn't the only one, I called everybody Mr. And then he came back and
they assigned him. My file cabinets were set up, three of them, tall filing
cabinets with about this much space [a few inches] in between each one. And they were trying to organize everybody,
people would come in three or four at a time. They put his desk right there
behind my file cabinets. So every time
I go to do my filing, there would be this eye looking at me through this
(space between the filing cabinets). |
Wanda tells a harrowing experience she
had while out driving in a Jeep with co-workers:
Jeep backwards down the mountain, Wanda takes charge[excerpt, see jw00se30.rtf
para 12] JJK: But, your
mother nearly got killed when she was up there. Tell him the story. WDK: (slight laughter
-- with hesitation or chagrin) AKK: What do you
(JJK:) know of the story? JJK: Well, just
what she told me you know. She was in
a Jeep. WDK: We [Wanda & 3 co-workers] were in a Jeep going up
the mountain. Two soldiers [Wink &
Glen] and Jerry, one of my friends,
and I. And Jerry and I were in the
back. And the two boys were in a Jeep
in the front. And we were like halfway
up the mountainside and the roads were gravel roads, and this side of the
mountain is here (pointing to one side) and the road is cut into it. And down here (pointing to the other side)
is just -- you know, way, way down.
And Glen, and Wink (spell) decided to change, without stopping the car
to change drivers. So one is going
over with the other and the car started backwards down the mountain. How it shifted like that, (I have) no idea,
but all of a sudden we are going backwards down the mountain -- AKK: Oh, he
probably put it in to neutral. WDK: Probably, I
don't know, I never got that detail.
And we are going down the mountain.
And Jerry stands up and she is screaming. And Wink and Glenn are still trying to
maneuver so they can get a hold of the wheel.
And Jerry is screaming. And I
smacked her in the face, and said: shut up! And I'm sitting there going
"steer into the side of the mountain!" And that's how we were stopped, they
steered into the side of the mountain. But, it was a horrible experience. AKK: But, you knew
to slap the girl and to tell the guy what to do. WDK: Right. (Laughter) AKK: "You shut
up! And you do your job!" WDK: We were four,
scared people after it was over. |
Radio
The Radio was an important medium
of communication in the pre war years and it was effectively used by President
Roosevelt for his “Fireside Chats” with the American people. Jack’s story
illustrates that only some families had a radio when he was very young but that
many more were part of a growing audience. By Jack’s teen years his family did
have a radio and it was a main source of entertainment. The Radio made a deep
impression and Jack even remembers the theme song of a program from 70 years
ago as well as various advertisement jingles. During the War Jack implies there
was not much new happening with Radio programming.
1920's
Radio - Happiness Boys Programs
[excerpt, see jk00ap16.rft, para U] 52. JJK Now I was born in 1915. And we
didn't have radio until the middle of the 1920's. And I remember we had little crystal sets
and you have a little pointer. And you would try to get this station. And you
get WDAK from Pittsburgh and that was it. And then all of a sudden in 1928,
the radio came out. And I remember in 1927 listening to the world series in
October. At the Schlessingers’ House [Jack’s
neighbors in Bath Beach, Brooklyn]. They had a radio. We didn't have a radio
and it was great to hear it. 53. JJK Then of course we moved out to
Saint Albens [Queens, NY] where we had a radio and we would be in
front of the radio and you would have certain programs coming and you would
just wait. 54. JJK I remember one program back in the
late 1927-1928. The Happiness boys. And I still remember it. We would go to
choir rehearsal at eight o'clock. And the Happiness Boys would come on about
7:30 in the evening. So the Schlesinger's were about 60 to 70 feet closer to
the church, so we would go over there to listen to the radio. And we would
hear the Happiness Boys.
How do you do everybody, how do you do?
How are you everybody, How are you?
Don't forget your Friday date, 7:30 until 8
How do you doodle, doodle, doodle, doodle, do!
Hello Billy, Hello Billy Jones and they were on the air. So then we would hear the last seconds
coming on. We would run like heck it was two minutes to eight. We would run
down to the church and just walk into the choir room about eight o'clock. |
Memorable
Advertisers Chicklets & Barbeso
[excerpt, see jk00ap16.rft, para V] 55. JJK And then there was another one.
Singing Sam the Barbersol man
No brush, no lather, no rubbing
Just wet your razor and begin.
Hello folks this is singing Sam the Barbasol man. 56. JJK And there was another one. [Sing
song]
Any time your feeling blue,
And you don't know what to do.
Chew chicklets and cheer up.
There is a fresh and minty flavor - and it goes on
[ chuckle] And then before the war you had.. 57. AKK This is about 75 years ago? 58. JJK This is going back to 1938. You
had programs on Eddie Canter, Fred Alen, Jack Benny, Bing Crosby. And they had
them programmed and people would sit around waiting for them. And Mrs.
Goldberg. Hello, Molly Goldberg. We would all listen and wonder what was
going to happen the next week. We would all be around the radio. Then of
course the war came along and everything was static. Then the first thing you
know we went to TV. |
Film
During the
1930's & 1940's film played a great part in reporting on and shaping the
North American culture. Movies also confront historians with difficult
challenges in the reading of evidence.
It had impact on how stereotypes were made or changed For example, the satiric woman cheered
everybody with her affirmation both of identity and of competence.--[by 1944) Lauren Bacall carried the type from farce into drama and furthered
the impression that the liberated female could cope with anything. Film monopolized public attention. In 1936,
sixty nine percent of the population went to the movies at least once each week
- a figure that understates the consumption since most movie houses showed
double features. [B02-N04]
While Jack was traveling,
even if he didn't go to the evening film showing in town, he could tell what
was playing. People returning home from the film would be singing the songs
which had been part of the showing. A few of the interviews illustrated that
Jack and his colleagues appreciated sharing good food and a well told story as
well as going to new movies when possible.
Going to Whitehorse, Food, Movies[excerpt, see jw00se30.rtf para 8] JJK: I remember when we went up to
Whitehorse we left New York in a RR troop transport, a
train, and we rode a couple of days and we got to Edmonton. And I'm telling you, we were
in camp 150 in Edmonton. And it was the greatest chow I ever had in all my
life. It was wonderful. I couldn't get
over it. I thought, boy, this is
really something. But I got my come-up-ins. We went from camp 150 to Prince Edward,
which is right out near Prince Rupert on the West Coast. On the train ride there, you had no place
to sleep at all and all they gave you was beans and coffee, twice a day. When we got to camp Edward the food there
was pretty good. Recognizing Films by the tuneJJK: I remember there were movies at that
time. When we were in Edmonton we went to the movies. What the picture was I don't remember now,
but the song was "Buckle down Windsocki,
buckle down. You can win Windsocki, if you knuckle down." So, I thought was a nice picture. But then they asked me to go when I was in
Prince Rupert. And I said, “Nah, I
don't care to go”. But I knew what the
picture was because when the guys came back they were singing "Buckle
down Windsocki, buckle down. You can win Windsocki, if you knuckle down." [Chuckle]. So then we get up to the Skagway,
Alaska. On the way up, we're in a ship
called the Ann Henifey, which they used to transport
horses in before we got there.
And it really stunk by the time
we got there. Oh, boy, it was something!
|
An Irishman’s story: The great contractor uses the elements[excerpt,
see jw00se30.rtf para 9] JJK: So, anyway we would have again
beans and coffee twice a day. So on
the way up we were in the inland waterway.
And it was beautiful. Glaciers
and all that stuff. And there was one
big Irishmen from New York, John Flynn. He was two hundred and 50 pounds on the hoof. And he stood about six feet and he was
solid. We were talking about the
construction jobs that we had worked
on. And amongst the group they had
been practically all over the world.
And John pipes up and he says,”There's the
best god damn contractor of them all”.
And I said,”You dumb Irishmen, who the hell
is that?” He says: "Old man nature, old man nature. The best contractor of them all". And he says "But it's only right,
because he has all those people working for him.". I said “Who is that?” He said "All those elements, all those
elements." JJK: So then we get to Skagway, Alaska and they asked me to go to the picture show. I said I am a little too tired, I think I will just read a book. I knew what the film was, because when they come back it was "Buckle down Windsocki, buckle down. You can win Windsocki, if you knuckle down." |
War Production Locations -mostly South and West
During the
War the biggest growth was in the south and west
of the USA. This is where most of the military and production centers were
built to support the war buildup. [B02-N05]
Jack and Wanda's work was related to the
war effort. However, Jacks work was outside of the USA first in The Caribbean
and South America and then in the Northwest of the American continent - Yukon. Wanda's was in the
Yukon.[North W] and then in New York. So they both were not part of the areas
of the biggest war buildup. In that sense, the stories may necessarily differ
from other workers who moved in connection with the War effort. I did not find
much in the reference works I consulted about overseas civilian jobs outside
the USA. [Check list for references]. This could be an interesting query for
future research but outside the scope of this project.
A forty
page booklet titled the "Alaska Highway" has been preserved
by Wanda and Jack. [B02-N06] It includes an interesting narrative by Don Menzies and photos
provided by the Alberta Government, National Film Board, Ottawa, Canadian Pacific Air Lines, U.S. Signal Corps and the
Edmonton Journal. It is dedicated to the highway
builders. In the spirit of the war time, the inside cover assures the reader
that "All the material in this book has been approved by the Official
Sensors". It reports that at the official opening in 1942, War Secretary Stimson
summed up the initial achievement: "Ten Thousand soldiers divided into
seven army engineer regiments and 6,000 civilian workmen under the direction of
the Public Roads Administration completed the job ..."
Jack and Wanda describe
their Yukon co-workers:
[excerpt for full see JW00se04.So4.htm para 18] WDK: 0h, it was a wonderful
experience. AKK: Were there many people from
other countries there? Or was it
mostly just Americans and Canadians? WDK: Mostly Americans and
Canadians. There weren't any[others] JJK: That's
all. We had a couple of Eskimos up
there. As a matter-of-fact, I had some
Eskimos in my barracks. And every
night they used to beat the hell out of one another. And we would get in there and we would
separate them. And the next night they
would be out there plugging away. And
finally we said well let them… kill one another, you can't stop them. JJK: They probably had something
to do with construction. AKK: Why
would they start to fight? JJK: It's
hard to say. I really don't know. Because we didn't speak too much. We didn't know their language. WDK: The
Canadians were from all over Canada. And the Americans were from
all over the United States. But a lot of them were from Kansas City. Near Kansas City. JJK: Oh,
yeah because that's where the job corporate offices were. AKK : The
headquarters? JJK: But a lot from Minnesota, an
awful lot from Minnesota. WDK: Yes, and a lot from New York too -- when you look back. AKK: So it was really typical of
many peoples war experience? In that a
lot of people had moved to another part of the country. |
Soldiers in Yukon: American, Canadian, Russian
[excerpt for full see JW00se04.So4.htm para 19 WDK: Then
of course all the soldiers that were stationed up there too. AKK: How many soldiers stationed
around there? What were they
doing? Were they guarding? Or -- JJK: I think they were -- didn’t
we hear something about 20,000 soldiers?
You see they had a lot of camps all around there. And they had about 200 women. AKK: Was it mostly Canadian soldiers? WDK: No, no, Americans. JJK: United States soldiers. AKK: But this was all Canadian territory? Were they supposed
to be guarding the road? Was it
supposed to be a national supply
route? WDK: They were working together. They were Canadian soldiers too. But not Canadian soldiers to the extent
there were American soldiers. JJK: There were a lot more
American soldiers up there. AKK: Were they lightly armed? WDK: They were training as well. JJK: They were engineers, and then
they were I guess maybe some infantry men.
Because the thought was, there is always the possibility that the
Japanese may come through and we had to stop them. Of course they never got closer then Attu (Aleutian chain), which was thousands of miles from
where we were WDK: Yeah,
but the Russian subs were right there.
And even though Russians was -- JJK: Yeah, the Russian subs were
there. The Russians were up there too
because Whitehorse was one of the places they would ship planes to
Russia. They'd come to Whitehorse, to
Fairbanks and then I suppose they'd jump over. But I've seen the Russians up there. AKK: Would the Russians go across?
In your camps? Or passing through? JJK: No, no, I really -- they
would just be a couple -- and maybe they just come in for a plane. AKK: Oh, they'd come in and pick up
the planes and fly them across. WDK: Yes, yes. The airport was there in Whitehorse. AKK: In Whitehorse, not too far from
where you were? So the Americans would
fly the plans there, then they would fly over a bunch of Russians pilots,
they'd pick up the planes and fly them across. JJK: Yeah, I think they had the pilots maybe in Fairbanks, Alaska. And then they would fly them over. You know. But I can remember the planes coming through in Whitehorse and I happen to be down at the airfield a couple of times. And they would have to check them out and every thing once they landed. I can still see the mechanics there, the Army mechanics, going out there, taking their gloves off. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. So cold they would put their gloves on again and they'd run back in to get warm |
Working
outside in the cold
[excerpt for full see JW00se04.So4.htm para 20 WDK: Well, they also had those big
like-- you probably saw the pictures of them in the depression, when they
have them out on the streets with the homeless people? Like the big 50 gallon drums and they would
make the fires there. AKK: Right, with the wood in them.
And they would go and get their hands warm because they had to use their
hands. WDK: I was in the hospital up there,
and the pipes went that night underneath the hospital. One of the water pipes broke. And they had those [fire drums], it was so
cold. And they are out there and I
felt so sorry for them. Because you
could only stay out about 10 minutes working on stuff and then you had to
warm up again. JJK: They had to dig down through
all the dirt, which you know was frozen.
And then they had to get to the pipes and get to the leak. And I was in there talking to some of my
friends. And I thought to myself, geeze, I'm glad I'm not a plumber tonight. Going under
there and do what they could. WDK: When I look back of over my life, and look at the different sections of it, it would be hard to say what was the most interesting. And yet it was so diverse. It was so different |
Communities
During the
War effort new communities were created. Usually the
established community had some suspicion of each new group entering a
production locality. But in most communities, as the newcomers were observed to
be hard workers and good neighbors, differences faded and a sense of
sustainable community prevailed. [B02-N07]
|
Jack’s South
American Friends in [excerpt for full see JW00se04.So4.htm para
09 JJK: There were a lot of people with the United States
engineering department that I had worked with in Trinidad. After they left Trinidad
they went up to the Yukon and so I saw them again. And we renewed our friendship. As a matter-of-fact, one of the guys I
roomed with in Trinidad, Jules Kaitul. He was up
there so we got together again. And
Wanda became a very close friend of
his after awhile and his wife. WDK: They are the
ones that we stop with, when we went to Canada in 1965. . JJK: I know
Michael was a little fella. -- WDK: Again in 1969
and 1970, on the way back we
definitely stopped to stay overnight with Jules and his wife, Helen, in
Wisconsin [1969] 10. Close
Friendships, Canadian and
Americans AKK: So he made some friendships that lasted quite a
while? Was part of it because there was such close living arrangements too
and you worked -- WDK: Very, very
[close friendships]. I don't think
that (because of close living arrangements).
It was just nice people from all over. |
Not returning to Canada
. Farm Population decline,
The farm
population declined dramatically during the buildup and war years. Roughly 1/5
of the population left for war and production centers. [B02-N08] Wanda mentioned her experience and why some family
members left the farm after 3 years of
crop failure during the Depression Years.
New
Devices on the Farm
The
introduction of new devices
&increased use of tractor speeded migration from the farm to the city in
postwar years [B02-N09] Wanda and Jack comment that when her family left the farm
when she was 11 years old they didn't have a tractor. After the War most farms did have much more modern
"labor -saving" devices and equipment.
Once in the
production centers or urban environment the young people found many of the
trappings o f the modern life they had missed in the countryside and they were
reluctant to return. [B02-N10]
There seems
to have been a number of contributing factors for Jack and Wanda not returning to Canada to raise the family as they had planned. One
may have been their lack of secure job opportunities and amenities which they
were reminded of while they were visiting Jack’s family and friends in NY. The
Keefe myth of returning "to live in Canada" was played out
in various years. There were a number of summer visits by members of the NY
family to be with the extended family of relatives in western Canada. Jack and
Wanda's first daughter [Elizabeth] settled in Edmonton area, married and raised four children there.
George, their fourth son worked in
the area for a time.
|
Staying in NY, Wanda has Visa Problem [excerpt
for full see JW00se04.So4.htm para 21] AKK: It
must have been quite a shock to stay in New York City if you thought you're going back to the Yukon or Alaska. You were very happy there, you know what
it's about, you've just gotten married, you are planning on going back
together. All of a sudden it didn't happen, and it's a whole different thing
that you hadn't expected? WDK: Not only that, he had to get a
job before - to keep me here. AKK: So, it looked like you might be
split up? WDK: Oh yeah, I had a month's
visitors permit. AKK: And
even though he was your husband? WDK: Even though we were married,
when he decided that we were not going back to Alaska we had to find a job
here. Then I had to go back up to
Canada, to Montreal. To get a visa
to come in. AKK: 0h, because you had come in as
temporary. If you had originally knew
you were staying, it would probably been okay. Right? WDK: Right, but we didn't plan on
staying here. AKK: So, did you go all the way back
to Edmonton or you just went over the
border? WDK: To Montreal. |
Immigrants
The fate of
different immigrants [especially from axis power] during the war was mixed.
Italians and Germans were generally accepted. The Japanese most often received
harsh treatment of separation to camps away from the west coast. There was some
definite stereotyping reinforced by films & magazines. [B02-N11]
During the interviews Wanda shared her experience of how she
as a Canadian and other "foreigners" were treated when as she
came over the boarder traveling alone without her American husband.
|
[Excerpt –
for full see [jw00se04.doc para.21] JJK: [Wanda went] to Montreal, and when
she came back my mother said to her: Wanda what was it like? Oh, she said, It was just a lot of
foreigners and me. WDK: I was disgusted with how they
treated the others -- because there was a lot of Russians coming into the
country and a lot of other people coming through. And they treated me very nicely because I
spoke English, I was Canadian. But some of those people who
couldn't speak English, that were coming across, they really treated them
like cattle. And I was telling Mom
about how disgusted I was. And I said:
"a terrible way they treated the
foreigners" and his mother started to laugh, she said “what do
you think you are?” I said you know, you're right, I never thought of that.
(Laughter) AKK: They were coming through Canada to come into the U.S.? WDK: Yes, yes they were coming across
the border. AKK: Some of them probably were war
refugees? WDK: Oh, yeah |
Jack and Wanda formed some very close friendships in the
Neighborhoods they lived before or after the war. It seemed most of the contact
was maintained with the newer friends over the years by initiatives from Wanda
and her female friends. Jack maintained
more close contacts with his early friends from his old neighborhood, High
School or college and sports buddies. In Seaford Long Island where Jack and Wanda raised most
of their children, families were largely from Italian, Irish and other European
descent. A future interview could explore in more depth the friendships within
the neighborhoods, commuter population and community associations. This could
include experiences with Political Clubs, the short lived Block Mothers for
Nuclear Alert, Roman Catholic Church,, Schools
and after school activities for the nine children such as
Scouts, Dance Lessons, Altar Boys, Sports Teams, paper routes and other working
arrangements for part time or summer jobs.
END Note list for B-2
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